Weaver you have PM matey,any chance you could have a quicky read and come back to me

aRd:

afro gti:

yea weaver I spoke to AMD (they know what their doing ) they've looked after my car pretty well in the past - mostly mopping up after other local mechanics. Anyway i'd rather they sort it and it be 100% right as I often have my son and other kids in the car.

I'm hoping it doesn't cost too much as I already have the brake fluid and a bled system

I did my discs/pads myself that was well easy compared to all this brake bleeding

Good luck, keep us all update how it goes. 

I'm going to be doing a full swap of all my calipers in the next few weeks

still no joy. Amd did a great job had car most of the day but unfortunately the pedal is still soft. i'm tempted to go back to the garage that messed up my brakes (NOT AMD) and ask for my money back. 

I'll see if it stiffens up over the week, if it doesn't i'm thinking maybe the master cylinder has gone

Bad news fro. I bet you have almost had it with your car now. I know just how that feels

I'm not being funny but are you 100% sure that AMD followed the bleed procedure to the letter?

It is the ONLY way to get a decent pedal feel. Any deviation, like not running through all the steps, will result in a soft mushy feel and a long pedal.

The only other thing is a failing m/c cylinder seal as you have said. I still think that is unlikely though

 Weaver problem solved mate, took it back to the original garage they bled the master cylinder and I can now stop on a dime. Happy Days

afro gti:

 Weaver problem solved mate, took it back to the original garage they bled the master cylinder and I can now stop on a dime. Happy Days

oooo happy days :)

why cudnt they do it first time round tho?

bizarre how people on a forum know more then a mechanic who claimed he'd been working on german cars for over 20 years beware of Leyton Service centre - mods apologies if I'm not allowed to say that i'll remove it

Good news Fro

It does beg the question why they didn't do it in the first place? Also I am still surprised that AMD couldn't sort it out either.

Anyway at least it is finally done now and you can enjoy your car again

Just a couple fo questions for this procedure?

when you open the bleed nipples, do you have to have both sides open at the same time, or can you do one side at a time (I will have it on axle stands)

Also, when you pump the brakes 10 times, do you press the pedal all the way, or is it just halfway down, as I thought it could damage the master cylinder seals?

when you say 17 times, do you keep changing the channel back down to 1 then 2 every time, or does vagcom do this automatically?

Going to attemp doing this tomorrow, brakes bled 7 times, master cylinder 4 times, and this is now my last resort!

Thanks for any help in advance

afro gti:

ADi Nuff Valves:

afro gti:

adi nuff did you do this with the car on the ground?

The other night when I re-tried it without bleeding (just to test my theory on the pedal adjustment) I had all four wheels on the floor.

But as Weaver says, you just need the front wheels off to bleed the front calipers during the actual ABS bleed procedure done with VAG COM. But it's a good idea to flush out the rears while you're at it.

Thanks my brakes front/rear have been bled the standard way but the pedal is currently travelling to the floor. So I was hoping to get someone to perform the ABS bleed in the hope that the firmness would return. Brakes feel to dangerous to drive at the moment and the garage that changed my fluids didn't have access to vagcom

double post DOH!!!!!!

gtimk4180:

Just a couple fo questions for this procedure?

when you open the bleed nipples, do you have to have both sides open at the same time, or can you do one side at a time (I will have it on axle stands)

Also, when you pump the brakes 10 times, do you press the pedal all the way, or is it just halfway down, as I thought it could damage the master cylinder seals?

when you say 17 times, do you keep changing the channel back down to 1 then 2 every time, or does vagcom do this automatically?

Going to attemp doing this tomorrow, brakes bled 7 times, master cylinder 4 times, and this is now my last resort!

Thanks for any help in advance

you have to start at furthest point from cylinder and work in a sequence towards it n/s rear, o/s rear, n/s front, o/s front in that order

nickturbo:

afro gti:

ADi Nuff Valves:

afro gti:

adi nuff did you do this with the car on the ground?

The other night when I re-tried it without bleeding (just to test my theory on the pedal adjustment) I had all four wheels on the floor.

But as Weaver says, you just need the front wheels off to bleed the front calipers during the actual ABS bleed procedure done with VAG COM. But it's a good idea to flush out the rears while you're at it.

Thanks my brakes front/rear have been bled the standard way but the pedal is currently travelling to the floor. So I was hoping to get someone to perform the ABS bleed in the hope that the firmness would return. Brakes feel to dangerous to drive at the moment and the garage that changed my fluids didn't have access to vagcom

joe we can have a crack at this whils we are doing your wishbones mate

Thanks for the offer mate but it got sorted. I took it back to the garage and told them to bleed the master cylinder - job done!

Assuming the 1.8 is the same as the 1.9TD (which I'd assume it is), it's actually O/S Rear, N/S Rear, O/S Front, N/S Front.  As the brake lines run down the N/S of the car from the engine bay and travel across to the O/S at the front and rear.

 The abs only works on the front wheels? From what I've read you only need to bleed the front brakes with vagcom, this should push out any air thats in the abs pump, then I'll do the rest of the car again with  the normal method with the eezibleed?

What I meant was, when you turn on vagcom procedure, it says open the front bleed nipples, do you have to have both front nipples open simultaneously, or can you just do one side at a time?

Also do you push the pedal down all the way, or halfway when you press it 10 times?

gtimk4180:

 The abs only works on the front wheels? From what I've read you only need to bleed the front brakes with vagcom, this should push out any air thats in the abs pump, then I'll do the rest of the car again with  the normal method with the eezibleed?

What I meant was, when you turn on vagcom procedure, it says open the front bleed nipples, do you have to have both front nipples open simultaneously, or can you just do one side at a time?

Also do you push the pedal down all the way, or halfway when you press it 10 times?

do the abs bleed procedure last

if you do the abs first and then the rest of the car, the pedal feel will go back to the floor

hafizur

ADi Nuff Valves:

Ross tech have it listed on their site although they make it sound a lot more simple than it is.

This is from memory so I may get it slightly wrong, oh and perform at your own risk. I'm just describing the procedure and what I did. If in doubt, take it to a garage!

Key in ignition and turned on, but car not running.

Go into the ABS Brakes section.

Click on basic settings.

On the 'group' bit click up to set it from 000 to 001. It will then say about pressing and holding the pedal. Press the pedal and hold, after a short delay you'll feel the pedal push back against your foot. Hold the pedal down until it stops pushing against your foot. There's a noise from somewhere while this is happening, not sure what from, that's what I want to know from Ross Tech.

I can't remember if you then have to click to go from 001 to 002 or whether that happens when automatically. Anyway, it will then tell you to open both front caliper bleed nipples.

Then when you click from 002 to 003 you'll here the abs pump activate for about 10secs. This will pump fluid through so make sure you can keep your resevoir topped up!

Once that has finished I think it tells you to pump the brake pedal 10 times. Again, this is pumping fluid through so keep an eye on that resevoir.

Then it will tell you to close the bleed nipples.

If you carry on it will cycle through these steps. I did it four times and then gave up as I wasn't sure how long it was going to go on for. Again, trying to get Ross Tech to fill me in on that point.

As I mentioned, I did this last night but without the opening of the bleed nipples and pumping the brake pedal and it's reduced the pedal travel back to how I think it should be. I can only assume that the first step is adjusting the pedal travel somehow.

Where did you get all this information from? On Ross Tech website it only tells to how to perform the basic procedure with Vag Com.

Procedure for Bleeding the ABS Brake Pump on VW Golf, GTI, Jetta, and Audi TT:

[Select]
[03 - ABS Brakes] 
[Basic Settings - 04]
Group 001
[Go!]

This will trigger the ABS pump to turn on for about 10 seconds. You should hear the fairly loud pump clicking during this time.

Click the [Done, Go Back] button and you're all set.

I do not see any information about bleeding the Brake calipers. 

I know what you mean. The roos-tech info makes it sound a little less involved than it actually is. Once you've started the procedure it will tell you to open bleed nipples, hold down brake pedal etc etc. Hope that helps.

On another note, my pedal feel has got a lot better with this warmer weather! I kid you not!

I'm going in to TTS on friday so will have a word with them about it.

Doesn't the Ross-Tech page also state that the procedures provided are not a replacement for the factory repair instructions? 

Ross-Tech ABS Brake Pump Bleeding page

Ross-Tech is not responsible for any damage or problems that may result from following these instructions. They are to be used at your own risk. As always, you should refer to a Factory Repair Manual for your vehicle!

Have you consulted a factory repair manual? 

When you developed your improved procedure, did you send Ross-Tech your improvments for consideration?

BeartheBruce:

Doesn't the Ross-Tech page also state that the procedures provided are not a replacement for the factory repair instructions? 

Ross-Tech ABS Brake Pump Bleeding page

Ross-Tech is not responsible for any damage or problems that may result from following these instructions. They are to be used at your own risk. As always, you should refer to a Factory Repair Manual for your vehicle!

Have you consulted a factory repair manual? 

When you developed your improved procedure, did you send Ross-Tech your improvments for consideration?

has this been updated yet?

i've just done it last weekend and heres what i found out:

tools & stuff you need

• brake fluid (3L)
• 2 x 11mm spanners
• 2 x bleed tubes with one way valves on
• 2 x receptacle at least 1L in capacity

first you need access to the front bleed nipples, i jacked up the front, placed on axle stands and removed both wheels.

then put the spanner, bleed tube and receptacle on each side.

open the brake fluid resevoir and have your fluid ready to keep the resevoir topped up at all times. i got a friend to do this to speed things up, it's probably possible on your own but will take a while longer.

goto ABS, basic settings blah blah whatever it is and click from 000 up to 001 and then you get a MSG on the screen saying "PRESS AND HOLD PEDAL" or words to that effect. whilst doing this the ABS pump is activated and the pedal can be felt kicking back

(002) it stops pumping and your told to relase the pedal and open the front 2 bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(003) it will tell you to wait for 10 secs whilst the ABS pump is activated and fluid is pumped out of the now open bleed nipples

(004) it tells you to pump the pedal 10 times and then close the bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(005) "PRESS AND HOLD BRAKE PEDAL" untill told to stop

(006) it stops pumping and your told to relase the pedal and open the front 2 bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(007) it will tell you to wait for 10 secs whilst the ABS pump is activated and fluid is pumped out of the now open bleed nipples

(008) it tells you to pump the pedal 10 times and then close the bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(009) "PRESS AND HOLD BRAKE PEDAL" untill told to stop

(010) it stops pumping and your told to relase the pedal and open the front 2 bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(011) it will tell you to wait for 10 secs whilst the ABS pump is activated and fluid is pumped out of the now open bleed nipples

(012) it tells you to pump the pedal 10 times and then close the bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(013) "PRESS AND HOLD BRAKE PEDAL" untill told to stop

(014) it stops pumping and your told to relase the pedal and open the front 2 bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(015) it will tell you to wait for 10 secs whilst the ABS pump is activated and fluid is pumped out of the now open bleed nipples

(016) it tells you to pump the pedal 10 times and then close the bleed nipples, then you need to click to continue

(017) ABS BLEED PROCESS COMPLETE!

once your done approx one litre of fluid will have been expelled from each caliper

points to note, i did not go full travel on the pedal every time, i probably only used about 75% of the pedal travel and i pumped the pedal slowly to prevent damaging the master cylinder seal which everyone is always banging on about.

so from the above you can see it's 4 complete cycles, not 17 cycles as someone suggested but 17 is the number you'll see on the left at the end when it says it's completed

So did it make naff all difference to pedal feel?

pretty much yeah......

there is a small difference, but it's hard to say if that came from bleeding the brakes, or bleeding the ABS pump as i ran 1L through all calipers and the MC, then did the ABS bleed.

why is it that some cars have a lot of pedal travel, but others are rock hard?

I was sceptical about this procedure, having spoken to the guys at my local dealership they hadn't used it in 10 years. However I did have a guy over on the TT forum who went from spongy to solid in an afternoon using this procedure.

Its VERY involved and you need to do exactly what it says for all four corners.

The normal bleed procedure requires that the pedal be depressed with a VAG tool whilst pulling new fluid through, if you consider the mechanics of the master cylinder what translates as 8 inches of pedal travel equates to an 1.5 inch amount of travel at the master cylinder so if the VAGCOM says push and hold then push and hold. This whole seal flipping thing is in my eyes urban legend, apparently the corrosion at the end of the master cylinder "flips the seals"

How can you have corrosion in an aluminium part that is not exposed to air or water? They are assembled using lithium grease to protect the bores this is not water based and absorbed by the brake fluid when put into service.

If VW insist that their technicians depress the Pedal prior to bleeding normally and their VAGCOM program says press and hold then for the correct results thats what needs to be done.

Depressing the pedal all the way whilst bleeding and following the VAGCOm ABS bleed procedure worked on the TT. Setup was 996 rears on 325mm discs and he now stops on a 6 pence. Before the procedure he couldn't trigger the ABS now if anything they are a bit too grabby.

For anybody in the NW that has a spongy pedal - Lee is your man... details on request.

IF ANYBODY HAS GOT A LINK TO A THREAD TO SOMEBODY WHO "FLIPPED" THE SEALS IN THE MASTER CYLINDER THEN LETS BE SEEING IT!!!!!!!!