Carcraft!! scamcraft!! - Car Buying and Selling Discussion - uk-mkivs

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#1 w16lam

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 09:28 AM

I post earlier the week thinking of buying a T sport but the saleman has giving me douts.


Just been to carcraft...nice clean cars, but how come i get the feeling its own by a bunch of loan sharks!


the T sport was £11.995 they offer me £2000 for my bora, which was quiet reasonable. they ask me to put a cash deposit of £5000.ok


then if a borrow £5000 on interest over 4 years I will be paying £60.45 per week, which sounds cheap but then if you add the figure over 4years,it bring the total up to £11606, thats over double to what i borrow!! so in total i would have paid £17606.40. thats 100% interest!!


The car was a 52 plate and the saleman says it has 36k on the clock and if i want it i would have to put a deposit of £500 today, as the car is at there merseyside branch.


Well i just came home and phone the branch the car hasnt done 36k, in fact it done 56k!


They manager just called saying they can lower the repayment to £46per week thats still £9024! strange how they can just complterely change the figures!


has any one had this experience before? i though they were a repectifull company and did i do the right thing of walking away!


will


P.s on the way there to sheffield i saw a bora heading south on the m1, R32 blue with R line kit also xenons, anyone on here? if so, very nice car!




#2 eze_e9399

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 10:05 AM

I think you have hit the nail on the head there!!


 


When I was looking for a Mk3 Astra ages ago, I went to see them and got a similar offer paying back a ridiculous amount, although when I told em I was paying CASH they all seemed to lose interest.....Funny that?!


 Looks like they are still doing their old tricks despite saying that they had done away with all the pushy sales and the nonsense that comes with it, I feel sorry for the poor buggers who actually buy a car from them!!



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Posted 10 November 2007 - 10:16 AM

sounds very dodgy to me!!!

basically they are giving you 5 grand worth of finance, so just ask them the apr on the deal and youll be able to work out your repayments by yourself.

if you got 5,000 worth of finance and were paying £60 per week thats about 14% interest on the sum outstanding, could work it out exactly later on if you wanted, (dont have a sceintific calc with me.)
its just that paying it back over 4 years makes it "seem" like your paying a huge amount

14% is probably a little higher than what competitors are offering? ask around


#4 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 10:23 AM

Finance:   Take a typical unsecured loan - say an AA loan (6.8% APR)


£5000 over 48 months works out at £118.80 a month (£702.40 total interest) or £151.00 a month if you take out payment protection.


....Or in other words, £27.42 a week without protection, £34.85 with protection.


Just took a look at the Carcraft website because that finance rate you were quoted sounds unbelievable in todays market. (What car is it your lookin at?). But if I choose a VW around that price and enter the figures into their online calculator, a £5000 loan over 4 years works out at £40.54 a week (APR 15.3%).


I can't comment on Carcraft because I've never heard of them, but when you consider you can pick up a 56 reg Golf TSi with less than 20K on the clock for around 13K from a franchised VW dealer, then £12K for a 52 plate with 56k on the clock sounds excessive.


I think I'd be giving Carcraft a wide berth...


 


 


 



#5 w16lam

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 10:39 AM

the saleman work out


 if i have £5000 on finance i will be paying £60.45 per week  which = to £241 per month. this will be for 4 years which  is £11606.40p which is double to what i borrow of £5k


also everytime i ask him the interest rate he seems to jump to something else....


will



#6 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 11:02 AM

Well I guess that tells you everything you need to know. By law thay are required to give you the APR but it sounds like you're wasting your time with this bunch.


Just took another quick look thru their website - I can't see many 'bargains' at first look. There is one thing that stands out though...


A Golf Mkv, 11,000 miles 3dr 1.4 GT Sport (it's the 170bhp model but they don't advertise that). It's in black, and as far as I can see the only added extra is vienna leather with heated seats (car may have a winter pack?) It looks to have headlamp washers but can't quite make out if those are xenons or not. (none of these extras are listed...) On the face of it, their asking price of £15200 seems very attractive indeed. It's located at their West Midland site if that's anywhere near you.


http://www.carcraft....90&categoryID=0


The only concern I have is that it's on a '56 plate. I'm not 100% sure that model was available pre March '07. It may therefore be an import but at that price I'm not sure if that matters much. May be worth checking out. If you could do a deal on that...



#7 Patch

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 11:18 AM

Getting a car from Carcraft on finance is pure madness mate,they don't even put the cash price on the windscreen.Just something like £40 a week!

#8 Rustynuts

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 11:36 AM

If I have some time tomorrow I'm gonna wind them feckers up a bit at Carcraft. Phone up and say I'm really interested in a car and string them for as long as I can with tales of "can't quite afford that one.." etc.[:D]


#9 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 11:38 AM


There is one thing that stands out though...  asking price of £15200 seems very attractive indeed. It's located at their West Midland site if that's anywhere near you.


http://www.carcraft....90&categoryID=0


The only concern I have is that it's on a '56 plate. I'm not 100% sure that model was available pre March '07. It may therefore be an import but at that price I'm not sure if that matters much. May be worth checking out. If you could do a deal on that...



 OK I'll take that back - I didn't realise how much these things have depreciated in the last few months!


Listers in Coventry are selling the very latest GT Sport model '57 reg (November 2007 ) 1.4 Tsi 170bhp in Steel Grey with 500 miles on the clock (no leather or heated washers) but with center armrest for £15650.  That's like a £4000 reduction!  Has the recent fuel prices made THAT much of a difference? 



#10 w16lam

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:08 PM

Getting a car from Carcraft on finance is pure madness mate,they don't even put the cash price on the windscreen.Just something like £40 a week!


 


I think that what makes them appealling ONLY £40 PER WEEK etc but if you sit down and really add the figures up, you be gob smack!


I dont think i will be going there again, Going to save up instead as x reg's T sport are around £5-6K in autotrader. Then if i wanted to sell the Bora privately.


will



#11 DaveB1970

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:57 PM

 


Used to be in the car job, don't forget Finance companies dont collect weekly they just take the Monthly figure and divide by 4.33 making it sound better, we were always taught to ask about budget and if somebody said "around £120 a month" Salesman was always taught to reply immediately with "Oh about £30 per week then" then multiply by 4..33 = £132 = £12 profit * 48months equals nearly £600 on top of the commision they were getting anyway.


Many Classics such as the test drive route with only left hand turns, returning from the test drive and parking the prospective car next to the old one.


I'm fully recovered now though.......[:S]


People on here talk about interest rates and APR's, but bear in mind that some people could not tell you what "Interest" is never mind what APR is or even what it stands for. These are the people that shop at Carcraft 



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Posted 10 November 2007 - 06:01 PM

STEER CLEAR!!! Where do I start.....?


I bought my girlfriend a Ford Puma from CarCrap 2 years ago. Paid off the finance early, but still ended up paying almost £14000 for a car listed at £8000!!


Also, I've heard their latest trick is to offer payment protection, which is actually supplied by a 3rd party company, & you can't cancel it!! A friend's son bought a Focus from them recently (1st car) & he decided to take it back while it was in the 14 day return period. BUT, he's been told he's got to pay all of the payment protection schedule at a cost of almost £12000!!! £3000 MORE than the cost of the car!!!


They make it sound good by telling you it's only £40 per month, but don't tell you it's over 4-5 years. Or that it's only £40 if you've got a perfect & unblemished credit score. Any glitches & you're on a different rate straight away, so you end up paying way over the odds. You're better off getting a loan from your bank, then go in & haggle over the price while they think you're taking finance, then bugger them up & pay cash!!


Also, they claimed the car we bought'd had a FSH (booklet was stamped up to date) & they said the car had been given a mini-service by them. But when we got it serviced, the mechanic showed us the state of the air-filter... full of dirt, leaves & even a cigarette-end. He reckoned it hadn't been done in at least 2 years. So we contacted the dealer whose stamp was in the book to check if the cambelt had been done, they said it hadn't been serviced by them in 3 years!!


Proper dodgy-dealers that make Arthur Daly look like a Saint.



#13 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 06:35 PM

 A friend's son bought a Focus from them recently (1st car) & he decided to take it back while it was in the 14 day return period. BUT, he's been told he's got to pay all of the payment protection schedule at a cost of almost £12000!!! £3000 MORE than the cost of the car!!!



They sound a right bunch of sharks but if that's accurate Rob, I'd advise your mate contact either Trading Standards or Citizens Advice a.s.a.p.  Again I'm not 100% sure on this but I was in the belief that by law, you have a minimum 14 day 'cool off' period with such schemes. However I believe most loan schemes offer a 30 day money back guarantee. (just google the words LOAN - PAYMENT - PROTECTION - COOL - OFF and you'll see all the major financial companies offer this in their t&c's). I think he should have been able to get a full refund without penalty. (Or as near damn it... he may have to pay for the cover that he's already used - i.e 14 days worth).


 It maybe worth his time checking this out because if the garage told him a bunch of porkies then CarCrap as you so eloquently describe them, could be in serious trouble.


Hope that helps. 


Extract from the Guardian, June 2007 regarding PPI schemes:


As well as being forced to spell out exactly how much the cover will cost, the watchdog (that's the FSA) is also proposing that customers be given a 30-day cooling off period during which they can cancel the policy, up from the current 14 days.


 



#14 BoraDave

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 07:51 PM

In my opinion finance from a so called "car supermarket" is always a bad idea, the rate's of interest they charge is criminal! your best bet would be to get a unsecured personal loan as mentioned above, you'll probably end up paying 600/700 quid over three years but its a damn site cheaper than CarCraft or such would charge you.


#15 sherad

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 02:08 AM

In a different thread you said Toyota had offered you £800 for the Bora.

I posted up that link where you can get an immediate offer for your car - most of them CarCraft places, to get it off your hands quickly, often at a fairish value.

By the sounds of it they offered you £2K, but I had no idea that you also planned to buy from CarCraft as well.... drop it off, get the cash and walk away imo.

I would have advised you steer clear from buying from them at stupid interest rates and whatever restrictive terms and conditions I suspect they might have.  They've always seemed to me like their main target audience is people who are struggling for cash, to get them a decentish car, but paying a high premium for it when all the interest is calculated.  And Celica's take a big depreciation hit over the first few years as well.



#16 stokeballoon

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 03:26 AM

STEER CLEAR!!! Where do I start.....?

I bought my girlfriend a Ford Puma from CarCrap 2 years ago. Paid off the finance early, but still ended up paying almost £14000 for a car listed at £8000!!

Also, I've heard their latest trick is to offer payment protection, which is actually supplied by a 3rd party company, & you can't cancel it!! A friend's son bought a Focus from them recently (1st car) & he decided to take it back while it was in the 14 day return period. BUT, he's been told he's got to pay all of the payment protection schedule at a cost of almost £12000!!! £3000 MORE than the cost of the car!!!

They make it sound good by telling you it's only £40 per month, but don't tell you it's over 4-5 years. Or that it's only £40 if you've got a perfect & unblemished credit score. Any glitches & you're on a different rate straight away, so you end up paying way over the odds. You're better off getting a loan from your bank, then go in & haggle over the price while they think you're taking finance, then bugger them up & pay cash!!

Also, they claimed the car we bought'd had a FSH (booklet was stamped up to date) & they said the car had been given a mini-service by them. But when we got it serviced, the mechanic showed us the state of the air-filter... full of dirt, leaves & even a cigarette-end. He reckoned it hadn't been done in at least 2 years. So we contacted the dealer whose stamp was in the book to check if the cambelt had been done, they said it hadn't been serviced by them in 3 years!!

Proper dodgy-dealers that make Arthur Daly look like a Saint.

 

http://www.moneysavi...-loan-insurance

Check the above link, for a guide on how to claim back poorly sold Payment Protection Insurance PPI

Dave 

 



#17 philo

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 04:05 AM

Car supermarkets are all the same, I had a bad experience in the carshop. First they made me fill in a questionaire and have an interview before I could enter the showroom, then they took my cash card off me (as a gesture of good will on my part!) before they let me even look at the car I was interested in (I was stupid to hand it over I know). Then they tried every hard sell technique in the book to make me sign up, I ended up with 4 guys crowded round me all demanding to know what was wrong with the deal they where offering. Took me best part of 2 hours to get my card back and get myself out of the place and even then they where on the phone every 30 mins asking when I was coming back.

 They are expert at making a crap deal look like a good one then putting the pressure on, its only my stubborn streak that stopped me signing the forms just to get them off my back.
 



#18 stav2006

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 04:12 AM

This company is completely dodgey.

 

When i was looking at getting my golf i noticed a high mileage 1.8T on their site for dirt price.  It seemed too good to be true.  After giving them a call they ensured it was the real deal and they were just trying to get rid.  I had to pay a deposit before id even seen the car so that they would transport it to the newcastle branch which is closer to me from Liverpool.  I took time off work and the day before i was due to go received a phone call telling me the car was actually a write off which they could no longer sell!?  Then the phone was decked on me.  It took 2 and a half months to get my deposit back from them.

 

I rang up a month or so later about the same car just to see if it was still available, i mean surely a write off would have been taken off the site straight away?  The lady on the phone insited the car was good to go and would just need to take my deposit........No thank you very much!



#19 w16lam

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 05:47 AM

Car supermarkets are all the same, I had a bad experience in the carshop. First they made me fill in a questionaire and have an interview before I could enter the showroom, then they took my cash card off me (as a gesture of good will on my part!) before they let me even look at the car I was interested in (I was stupid to hand it over I know). Then they tried every hard sell technique in the book to make me sign up, I ended up with 4 guys crowded round me all demanding to know what was wrong with the deal they where offering. Took me best part of 2 hours to get my card back and get myself out of the place and even then they where on the phone every 30 mins asking when I was coming back.


 They are expert at making a crap deal look like a good one then putting the pressure on, its only my stubborn streak that stopped me signing the forms just to get them off my back.
 


 


Thats similar to what happened to me. First they ask you for driving licence, proof of address and wage slips! it took me about ages to get back as everytime i ask for my documents back he keeps saying the underwriters are trying to get me a better deal etc...


I said i needed to pop into town he asked with a smurk, if am going to get some money for deposit!! Anyway manage to get the documents back about to leave, he came running out of the office, saying someone is ready to buy the car in merseyside  and if i leave a £500 deposit the car will be secure!!


He must think am daft, Because i wouldnt buy a pair of shoes without trying them on first, never mind buying a car without seeing it first in the fresh! When i say no,as i nee to think about it (well excuse for leaving) his manager came. typical manager a meat head, saying his colleague is here to sale the car today and what will it take to set the deal.


eventually after being blunt with him that i wont be buying today. (thank god my big brother was there) lol they eventually decide to give me the documents back!


Well i decide not in future to go to Carcraft, and now decide to save up instead, i should make it by next summer![:)] saving up.


will



#20 LHD

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 09:12 AM

All car supermarkets are NOT the same in my opinion. However outfits like 'carcraft' sell finance and other packages first and cars second, these type of outfits are always a con and offer poor value.

As someone else said they are also known as 'carcrap' which is all you need to know! Sounds like you had a lucky escape. It's always worth doing some research with a big purchase like a car ie look on google and contact your local Trading Standards office, 



#21 w16lam

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Posted 11 November 2007 - 09:25 AM

All car supermarkets are NOT the same in my opinion. However outfits like 'carcraft' sell finance and other packages first and cars second, these type of outfits are always a con and offer poor value.


As someone else said they are also known as 'carcrap' which is all you need to know! Sounds like you had a lucky escape. It's always worth doing some research with a big purchase like a car ie look on google and contact your local Trading Standards office, 



yeah thanks for the advice, i have spoken to the partner she said if i really want a Tsport then she will put some saving towards one in future( aww bless her) so going to start saving starting from now!


I did have a lucky escape but i feel sorry for the number of people whos been pushed into the sale! because they are quiet attempting until you really through about it. But withthe saleman in front of you throwing all options and benefits its hard to say no. But i managed it[:D]


will



#22 Mr zeus

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:31 AM

As already stated, these people are no more than loan sharks selling cars.


The best option is to borrow the money from the bank. Cheaper and you can sell the car as you own it. In these situations the finance companies own it!


But, some people cant get the loan from a bank so I do understand why they go to these places.


From what ive seen my mates go through, its pants! The cars service history is debateable. They are not cheaper than from a dealer. And you pay nearly twice the going rate! Another scam is a cack warranty of 6 months.


Ive never seen anyone get a good deal from any of these places.



#23 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 10:55 AM

As far as I'm aware we don't have Carcraft North of the Border (there are enough sharks here already!). From reading this thread I'm reminded of those "YES! Car Credit"  adverts where the dumb blonde dressed in a green jumpsuit says YES to everything...  And I'm sure she would if there was a guaranteed sale at the end of it.  [:P]


Think YES! Car credit went bust or something but it wouldn't surprise me in the least to find out the same people behind that venture were also the same people behind Carcraft. Having read this BBC link, the story sounds oh so familiar?


  http://www.bbc.co.uk...4/finance.shtml


 



#24 Mr zeus

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Posted 21 November 2007 - 10:12 AM

Following their 'exposure' in watchdog , they have reappeared as 'U can'.


Company Law in this country is a joke!



#25 eyeamsparticus

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Posted 21 November 2007 - 11:21 AM

Following their 'exposure' in watchdog , they have reappeared as 'U can'.


Company Law in this country is a joke!



You're not wrong there.  I didn't know about UCAN, so just had a look at their website. Makes this CarCraft bunch look professional ! 


Typical APR 27.9% !!  I realise there are certain pressures put on people these days and it can't be easy if you're in a position where someone doesn't have financial backing or cannot get credit, but my sympathy doesn't go so far to anyone who purchases a car from a company who quote an APR of 27.9%   If anyone finds themselves in the situation where they believe UCAR is the only option open to them, then to be quite blunt they should be saving their money instead of ploughing it into a depreciating asset.  [:@]


 



#26 PhilNUK

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Posted 21 November 2007 - 02:19 PM

steer clear mate...

I went in recently as they had a Golf tdi I liked the look of, as soon as I told them I wanted to pay cash they weren't interested..

 It has been known for people to spend their weekends parked up outside gates to Carcraft with signs in their car windows slagging the place off. Think their is a website full of people who have been 'done' by them, problems with warranties etc...


 



#27 bazking69

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Posted 22 November 2007 - 05:55 AM

These car supermarkets move large volumes of ex fleet cars at virtually cost and make their money charging people with crap financial history extrotionate APRs on finance, or indeed anyone. They also make up money inflating the value of cars by telling you they come with top notch warranties that aren't worth the paper they are written on half the time...

#28 bazking69

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Posted 22 November 2007 - 05:57 AM

Oh, and the salesmen usually tend to overly pushy and blagging morons who are only after your money and their commission. Go and see one with a problem on the car they sold you and they aren't interested in the slightest...





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