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Has anybody gone from a 2.0TDI to a 1.4TSI ?


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#1 Ian_TDI

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 07:40 PM

This follows on from a recent post about which mk7 to buy.

So I think the best non GTI is the 1.4TSI with 150BHP

I have currently got a mk6 2.0TDI 140, and eventually I want a nice Mk7

I can't afford or really justify the 2.0GTI, with 220BHP, and the next model down is the 1.4TSI.

 

Has anybody moved from a 2.0 TDI to the 1.4TSI ?

 

How do they compare for acceleration away from standstill, and for overtaking?

 

It looks like there is a 1.4 TSI (120) and the 1.4 TSI ACT GT (150).

 

Do any of the mk7 have the reversing camera?  Is it built in to the VW logo boot opener?

 




#2 cypher007

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 05:54 PM

if you do the miles stick with Diesel. I have a 1.0 TSI after a 1.9 TDI from 2003, and its well thirsty. I can only imagine a 1.4 TSI will be even worse. as far as the ACT vs normal I'm not sure of the reliability as when I watched a video of how the engine shuts down 2 cylinders in ACT mode it looked like a potential failure point after many years. what you've goto think is they will have only engineered these things to last maybe 100k miles.



#3 Ian_TDI

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 09:49 PM

I have a mk4 1.9TDI(130) now my daughters, and a mk6 2.0TDI(140), so when I go to petrol in a mk7 I don't want to have to take a drop in BHP.  I want petrol in my next car because diesel is going out of fashion now!

 

I don't really do long journeys (about 10k miles per year), so not bothered about keeping a diesel for economy.

 

I was horrified when I discovered what ACT means (runs on 2 cylinders when cruising).  I don;t really want any of that!  I agree a lot to go wrong!

 

I don't know if ACT can be turned off like the auto stop/start.

 

I like the feeling of a bit of power when I accelerate, so that is why I want similar or more power when I get a mk7

 

And I can't afford or justify the 2.0 GTI with 200+ BHP.



#4 cypher007

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 12:17 PM

its more the daily miles I'm thinking of, because of DPF issues.

 

I'm regretting being drawn into buying a petrol based on the quoted mpg. our old Toledo 2003 1.9 TDI exceeds the mpg quotes from when it was tested. I'm guessing the EU and or the manufacturers have been rigging the tests for about 10 years.

 

I think if I had seen the deals on some Nissan leafs that came up recently I would have bought a 2-3 year old leaf. £0 tax compared to £140 for starters. and they wonder why people are not buying new cars. I think if they needed to increase the VED take they should have spread the cost not lumped it onto new cars. if they want people to get new petrol cars they are going to have to give some sort of brake on VED. I mean how can a EU test cheating 2.0 TDI Audi A5 be taxed at £30 and a new 1.0 TSI £140?

 

calm need to clam myself down.

 

ok in your case I would not look at the headline BHP figure but look at the Torque. my 1.0 is 110BHP but it is as quick on paper as an old 130BHP TDI like your daughters.

 

my T5R is in its original form 240 BHP but the torque is 330NM. which is more than some cars running 300BHP.



#5 cypher007

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 12:21 PM

I find the TSI 1.0 engine is good when on turbo but then its drinking fuel like a drunk in a distillery.

 

low down theres nothing, I even find the rev counter dropping quite a bit on changes because unless I give it the beans so the turbo is spinning theres no torque.



#6 Ian_TDI

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 10:30 PM

Yes, I need to look at the torque figures when I am doing comparisons.  I know it is torque that counts really, because that is what you need to feel the mid range acceleration when you put your foot down to do some over taking.  And that is what I want, some decent ooomph when I need it!

 

I was looking on autotrader and some of the 1.4 TSI GT 150 don't mention ACT, but I don't know if it is missing from the list of features, or if indeed they don't all have it.

 

Shame the GTE is hybrid and so expensive and I don't like the combo idea.  And shame the golf E can barely reach 90.  Not that I cruise a 90, but you don't want the speed to top-out when you're trying to finish an overtaking maneuver.

 

Those are mad figures about the tax on the 2.0 A5 and the little 1.0 TSI!!!



#7 MartMan

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 08:34 PM

intersting thread, I’m thinking of getting a new 1.4 and currently have a 2 litre TDI. My logic is driven by price, new diesels are a couple of grand more; will I save that much on juice over three years?

I also see there’s a 1.5, any ideas what that’s like?

#8 dopiaza

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Posted 18 November 2017 - 02:07 AM

Engine torque means nothing really, it's torque multiplied by RPM that gives acceleration and that just happens to be power, ie BHP.

 

TDIs feel good at low revs because the product of torque x RPM gives good BHP, but the gearbox/differential as a torque multiplier makes the difference in feel.



#9 TomasLT

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Posted 18 November 2017 - 06:40 AM

Well excuse me you torque means sh#t mister. It does not. That's how you get a number, that's not how your car rolls forward. Torque is a force and bhp is power. Acceleration is, and I quote: "An object's acceleration is the net result of any and all forces acting on the object, as described by Newton's Second Law."


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#10 leeabr101

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Posted 21 December 2017 - 06:28 PM

Are there any issues I need to know regards the 1.4 tsi act as my daily commute has dropped to 8 mls so need a petrol?
Is high mileage an issue with these engines if looked after?

#11 dopiaza

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 10:10 PM

Well excuse me you torque means sh#t mister. It does not. That's how you get a number, that's not how your car rolls forward. Torque is a force and bhp is power. Acceleration is, and I quote: "An object's acceleration is the net result of any and all forces acting on the object, as described by Newton's Second Law."


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Torque does not do work, ie cause acceleration. Power does that. Power is a product of force and movement. Try to undo a wheel nut that seized and you have applied loads of torque but done no work unless it moves.



#12 TomasLT

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 09:49 AM

Torque does not do work, ie cause acceleration. Power does that. Power is a product of force and movement. Try to undo a wheel nut that seized and you have applied loads of torque but done no work unless it moves.

Work is measured in J which is force (N) newton) applied thru one metre (m) metre). In order to do work you need to use energy (J) joules).
Power is the rate at which energy is consumed. Simply energy per time (W) watts).
Acceleration is change of velocity per time (m/s) metre/second). Acceleration is the net result of all forces (N) acting on the object.
Velocity is speed with direction of motion (m/s). If not going in a straight line and/or speed isn’t constant means acceleration.
Let’s get back to power: since we know power uses energy, which in turn is work per time. Power = J / time. And work is force per distance. Power = N • distance / time
But wait, distance per time is velocity, so power = N • velocity. And again force is mass times acceleration we get power = mass • acceleration • velocity.
Power = torque • velocity.
As you can see you can’t have one without the other, everything intervenes.
Real world example, you are trying to move in 6 gear from standstill, what happens, it doesn’t move, because torque is too low. And when you shift to 1st you increase torque, but input power stays the same.

Regarding your nut. No work has been done on a nut, but energy has been spent so work is done, just elsewhere, say your dewalt or your muscles.
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Edited by TomasLT, 04 January 2018 - 10:10 AM.


#13 northpole

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 02:15 PM

don't be scared of the AC technology it dates from the 90-ties... remember the BMW 850 CSI 5.0 12 cylinder? that thing would only run on 6 cylinders when cruising/ coasting at the same speed, or when under a certain speed and under a certain rpm.... it made it more economical and the ones that are still alive today have almost no problems with said configuration.... remember those things ran of 16 bits ecu's nowadays the ECU's run dual- or quad-core processors i don't see that as a problem.... 

 

and if i were to get a mk7 the 1.4TSI GT AC is a good contender...



#14 egooverdrive

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 03:42 PM

ACT sounds like a good idea to save fuel when the engine is under light load.

 

My concerns would be more mechanical than electronic.  It would  seem that there could be an imbalance in the loading on the camshaft when running on 2 cylinders. Also when cylinders shut down I’d be concerned about a lack of lubrication on the piston rings with no fuel being supplied.

 

I’m sure these issues have been address by the engine designers but being a bit of a luddite I tend to stick to what I know.


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#15 northpole

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Posted 05 January 2018 - 10:50 AM

it is old mechanics as i stated before nothing to shocking the only difference is that it is a 4 cylinder this time instead of a 12 cylinder... if you are worried about the imbalance and lubrication don't be, like i said before this technology is old, BMW used it before and don't forget the amount of torque and BHP the 850 CSI put at the crankshaft yet most of those cars (and their engines) are still running  (collectors items and they were introduced in 1991, some mk4 owners are younger than that). Apart from that, they were the first to give normal road cars a drive by wire throttle and a 6 speed gearbox (7 if you count the reverse gear) and is all that common now? I bet you that this technology will be utilized more often for internal combustion engines just to meet the stricter emission laws... and from a few things i have read Nissan is going to use this technology also (be it that they are going to use this technology for a hybrid) and we all know that once the Jap's start using it it soon will be used  around the world.... 

 

soon we won't know any better... it's just like how we got used to having computers,laptops, mobile phones, and smart phones... 



#16 TomasLT

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Posted 05 January 2018 - 06:07 PM

Chevy uses it. Can’t remember who else, but it’s definitely not a new thing.


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#17 Ian_TDI

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 01:24 PM

Apparently it is always the same 2 cylinders that shut down on low power driving.

I'd have thought it was better to have different cylinders shutting down each time just to prevent uneven wear somewhere.

 

Regarding "BMW CSI have used it since 1991"  That may be so, but probably has no relevance at all to the Golf ACT of 2017 which likely uses a totally different configuration and technology.  A lot can happen with engine advances in nearly 3 decades.  So I don't get a warm feeling from that BMW at all!  Still intersting info though.

 

I'm like egooverdrive above, I'd rather stick with what I know.  but since the TSI 150BHP golf isn't available without ACT, I'll have to have it,  I just want a quick Golf, but not as over powered as the GTI.



#18 northpole

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 03:20 PM

you can never have to much power.... but economical the 1.4 tsi ACT is the pick of the bunch... lower insurance class/ better on fuel/ lower tax bracket etc etc etc and they can be pushed to run just under 200 bhp with a remap 



#19 TomasLT

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 06:23 PM

Over powered golf? Lol wat


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#20 Ian_TDI

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 12:57 AM

OK, OK, sorry, wrong expression there.  I agree, you can't have too much power!

What I meant to say is  "...High Powered as the GTI".  I don't want that... 

Well I do, but I want want economy too.  And I don't want to spend extra money on a GTI.

 

northpole is right, the 1.4TSI ACT with 150BHP is the one to go for.  Exactly for the reasons he said.

But I am not sure I like the idea of boosting it and getting 200BHP from a 1.4 engine.  That just doesn't sound healthy.  Although I guess it only works that hard when you push it hard.

 

I would like an E-Golf, all electric one day, but (as I have moaned on here before), I don't want a car that bottoms out at 93mph, which could be dangerous in an overtaking situation, when you sometimes need to go that little bit faster.  Plenty of other all electric cars can do 100+ so why not the Golf?  I don''t know if they can be tweaked to let them go a bit faster at the expense of reducing the traveling distance to next re-charge.  Same as any engine really, it's a choice of fast or far.



#21 northpole

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 07:50 AM

it's electrics you can mess with it if you know your electrical stuff... basically if you can install an extra power booster/amplifier... there is one guy in the states that has bought a tesla s p90d stripped it and uses it for drag racing and he is now messing with the power basically installing extra power amplifiers.. 

 

that said the 1.4tsi is boosted with both a supercharger and a turbo... basically the supercharger has an electrical clutch once the turbo kicks in it doesn't put an extra strain on the engine...  that is why it can be pushed a lot further with a remap and a smaller pully on the supercharger ;) and no it won't make it any less economical it'll just make it faster as from what i got told by JD engineering they make the mixture a bit leaner in the higher rpm range than oem so it retains it's average mpg at high speed... 



#22 TomasLT

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 09:40 AM

Should strap some laptop coolers to it

Funny times are coming. Or strange


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Edited by TomasLT, 17 January 2018 - 09:40 AM.


#23 northpole

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 11:27 AM

yeah electric cars can be fun if execute well, have high power and when they are finally capable of 400 miles on a full charge...  



#24 TomasLT

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 07:15 AM

I like them too. Mean torque all the time. Was toying with the idea of making go kart with electric engine in it. So far I could only get my hands on industrial electric engines which are old design and heavy and never below 240V. Or find some smashed prius in scrapyard, but it’s kind of old too and probably costly.


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#25 thekwaze

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Posted 21 March 2018 - 08:37 AM

I used to have an Audi A3 140bhp 2 litre TDI and swapped to a Golf Mark 7 1.4 TSI 120bhp Match as I found the suspension too hard on the Audi and on the Golf GTi

My plan was to get a Race Chip installed thus having the soft comfort of the Golf without the bone jarring suspension of the Audi/Golf GTi

And it worked a treat - obviously it's not perfect as gear ratios etc come into the equation, but it feels nippy when necessary, although my main reason for wanting a bit of extra bhp was just for joining the motorway traffic safely.

So to sum up, yes I would think the 150bhp version should be nice.....as long as the suspension isn't too firm, but that may not bother you anyway - I've had several GTi Golfs in my younger days and never noticed the suspension.

My only irritation with the Mark 7 Golf is the stupid boy racer style automatic engine revving thing as you go to engage the clutch at standstill and it's also almost impossible to engage the clutch smoothly - maybe there's a cure if anyone knows?



#26 northpole

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 07:47 AM

that would be someone that can hack into the gearbox settings and dial it back a bit... but i know what you mean... it sounds and sometimes looks like people are trying to race at traffic lights but it's the gearbox settings that do this... when i had a test drive in the mk7 1.4 TSI i noticed it too and i too didn't like it... but that is the way they are setup... i bet you some companies are going to make some extra money on that, so look at the big name remappers and ask if they can sort that out ;) 



#27 Ian_TDI

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Posted 12 April 2018 - 12:16 AM

Ooooh, please explain "automatic engine revving thing as you go to engage the clutch at standstill"

I haven't driven a mk7 yet.  That sounds awful!  I'd want that modd'd out if possible too.



#28 rayaans

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Posted 20 April 2018 - 11:41 PM

Can't say you would be disappointed. My 1.4TSI (122hp) one is 10 years old and we have a 1.4 TSI MK7 GT (150hp) in the family too.

These engines are pretty punchy. Not a huge difference in engines between mine and the 150hp bar that the MK7 is smoother and feels stronger at higher speeds.

I'm averaging 45mpg in mine in mixed driving but it's a decade old. Would presume the new ones with their fancy tech can achieve 50mpg if not more.

#29 Ian_TDI

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 01:02 PM

re- electric go cart comment above...

When I was at shool in the late 70's the metal work teachers had made some simple go carts using a car battery and a car starter motor, and a big foot operated switch.  And they went like the clappers!  I don't know what they used for cogs to get the motor to drive the back axle.  They worked a treat,  That was in the days when scrap yards had lots of simple re-useable parts.

 

I've still not got a mk7 yet, but definitely want the 1.4TSI 150, unless I can get a mk7.5 1.5.

I like the idea of the Match version because this comes with extras like the reversing camera.







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