[Mk4 Golf] "THE" Brake Discussion. Upgrades/Sizes/Info - Suspension, Brakes and Chassis - uk-mkivs

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"THE" Brake Discussion. Upgrades/Sizes/Info



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#1 fenwick458

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Posted 07 September 2007 - 05:09 PM

 

I'm currently in the process of upgrading my brakes, and i have been trying to find out as much as possible from this forum, but there does not seem to be a lot of info on it, so i thought it would be a good idea to get all the info in one place.

Heres all the brake sizes on the VAG range, and what they are fitted to as standard.

VW Golf R32 | Audi TT 3.2 Quattro


  • The Front brakes are 334mm x 32mm Vented 2-piece Discs, Twin piston(32mm/42mm) calipers

  • The Rear brakes are 256mm x 22mm Vented Discs, 38mm Lucas singles

    Seat Leon Cupra R

    The Front brakes are 323mm x 28mm Vented (grooved/drilled option) discs with 4 piston(34/38mm) Brembo calipers
    The rear brakes are 256mm x 22mm Vented , with 38m Lucas single piston calipers 

    Audi TT-Quattro (225hp) | VW Golf anniversary  | Golf GTI AUQ  | Skodá Octavia VRS | VW Golf V5 170 | VW Golf V6 4 Motion


  • The Front brakes are 312mm x 25mm Vented Discs, 54mm ATE single piston calipers

  • The Rear brakes are 256mm x 22mm Vented Discs, 38mm Lucas single Piston calipers

    Audi TT (180hp)


  • The Front brakes are 312mm x 25mm Vented Discs, 54mm ATE single piston calipers

  • The Rear brakes are 232mm x 9mm Solid Discs,

    Golf GTI 1.8T | Golf 130/150 TDI | Golf V5 150 | Seat Leon 130/150 TDI and 20VT


  • The Front brakes are 288mm x 25mm Vented Discs,  54mm ATE single piston calipers

  • The Rear brakes are 232mm x 9mm Solid Discs

    Golf 2.0 8v | 1.8 | TDI 115 | TDI 110 | TDI 100 | TDI 90


  • The Front brakes are 280mm x 22mm Vented Discs, Single piston calipers, caliper carrier integrated into hub (FS III's)

  • The Rear brakes are 232mm x 9mm Solid discs

  •  

  • Golf 1.4 16V | Golf 1.6 16v | Golf 1.6 8v | SDI

  • The Front brakes are 256mm x 22mm Vented Discs, single piston calipers, carriers integrated into hub (FS III's)

  • The Rear brakes are 232mm x 9mm Solid Discs

  •  

  •  

  • BRAKE DISC INFO



  • Heat capacity

  • Heat capacity is the amount of energy that can be absorbed by the disc before the temperature gets high enough to cause brake fade. The mass of the disc is proportional to the heat capacity. Therefore, a lighter disc will not allow as much energy to be absorbed as a heavy disc.

    Solid vs Vented

  • Vented discs are hollow with internal vanes. This increases the surface area of the disc and allows air to cool the disc mass more effectively. A 5Kg  vented disc will cool much quicker than a 5Kg solid disc. In many cases, a vented disc can weigh less than a solid disc and still provide more effective braking because of the cooling effects alone.

    Curved vs straight vanes

  • The vanes inside vented discs provide structural integrity to the disc itself as well as cooling. There are several different styles of vanes:

  • Straight vanes are the most common because they are easy to manufacture.

  • Curved vanes are common in higher performance cars as they promote better cooling better than straight vanes.

    Where does the air go?

  • For solid discs, all the air travels over the surface of the disc - the same surface as the brake pads.

  • For vented discs, a considerable amount of air flows through the interior. Because it's spinning so fast, it creates a vacuum and air is sucked into the center of the disc and forced out through the edges. The air follows the pattern of the internal vanes.

    Drilled discs

  • A common misconception is that the purpose of drilled discs is to promote cooling. This couldn't be further from the truth, The real purpose is to reduce weight.

  • Drilling can allow brake dust and gases to escape, but with modern brake pads, this usually isn't a problem. Choosing a drilled disc for that purpose doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

  • Many high performance cars like Porsche and Mercedes AMG come with drilled discs from the factory. For these cars, the drilling is mainly about the looks, just like bright red calipers. When people do serious high-performance driving on a trackdays, they usually swap to regular plain discs.

  • Drilled discs generally wear out brake pads faster and produce much more brake dust as a result.

  • Drilled discs have a shorter service-life than plain discs and tend to develop stress fissures/cracks over their lifetime

    Grooved Discs

  • Grooved discs keep the pad surface clean and allow certain gasses to escape which improves performance. not too many grooves though, you only need 6 or so, anymore and it it just for looks(e.g tarox cheese graters)

  • For street driving they may make a marginal improvement in initial brake "bite"

  • Grooved Discs are great for shedding water and mud off the rotor surface as in Rally racing or wet-weather racing.

  • Grooved Discs do accelerate pad wear and produce more dust just like drilled discs do. They also add noise and vibration into the system. For many these issues are annoying enough to not choose grooved discs, unless you do alot of rallying!

    Two-piece discs

  • Two piece discs have several advantages including lower weight while maintaining most of the heat capacity and better cooling by having a more open center section

  • Two piece discs increase costs and generally a poor choice for street cars. For racing, they are great!

    Plain discs

  • Plain discs are the best choice for 99.9% of applications

    Name brand vs non-name discs

  • Why pay double the money for a Brembo discs vs. GSF cheapo's? You guessed it there is pretty much no benefit. Its all the same stuff, Spend you money on brake pads

    Specialist Discs (carbon, carbon-ceramic, carbon-kevlar, etc.)

  • Some really expensive cars come with an option for fancy brake materials. These brakes are excellent for trackdays since they are relatively lightweight but can withstand extreme temperatures without brake fade. This provides a competitive advantage for racing.

  • For the street, it doesn't help much at all, and they squeal alot and wear fast.

    Warped discs

  • if your discs are warped its because you have heated them up too much during hard breaking. probably nackered but you might be able to get them skimmed. 

  •  

  • BRAIDED BRAKE LINES

  •  

  • Braided Brake hoses

  • Braided brake lines don't expand or bulge out, therefore reduce pedal travel, and increase the force applied to the brakes. I have never tried braided lines before, I think they don't really do alot on modern cars (especially the golf) because the servo makes the pedal feel soft anyway. It is a FACT that they apply more power to the caliper, but the caliper can easily apply twice the amount of pressure to the discs than the tyres are capable of handling anyway, i mean unless you have a track car with wide slick tyres, these are not really necessary.

  •  

  • BRAKE FLUID

  •  

  • If you want to improve your braking power on a budget, try using a Performance brand of Brake fluid and bleed your brakes. it makes alot of difference!

  • Chances are your fluid now is old and has absorbed some water and air and is not as good as it should be so the pedal will feel spongy. Sort this by bleeding your brakes and use a decent brand of fluid, ATE Super Blue Racing sounds good, and it's blue! how cool is that! anyway, it does make it easier to see when the new fluid has come through, and it has a low viscosity, it resistant to absorbing water, and has a boiling point of 200°C, which means less brake fade. another one is Castrol SPF Racing, it's expensive though!

  •  

  • BRAKE PADS

  •  

  • There's lots of different types of these on the market, EBC, Mintex, Tarox, Pagid, Black Diamond, Brembo to name a few.

  • They are just made better, and depending on what you go for, they will provide better braking power / low dust etc..

  • They come in different levels of agressiveness, for example the EBC range is as follows:

  •  

  • EBC Blackstuff - Standard use

  • EBC Greenstuff - Street

  • EBC Redstuff - Fast Street

  • EBC Yellowstuff - Track

  • EBC Bluestuff - Race

  •  

  • if you go for the "race"option be prepared to get more dust, squealing/vibrations and accellerated pad wear and a harsh feel to the brakes - unsuitable for normal driving so thats why theres a range. 

  • buying performance brake pads will make a difference to your braking power, for not alot extra cash over the standard pads.

  •  

  • BRAKE BIAS

  •  

  • Ever wondered why the front brakes are always bigger? By design most original factory brake systems do not split the brake force 50/50 between the front and rear axles. This is because under braking the front tires offer increased traction as weight is transferred forward. This additional traction can be utilized by increasing the brake force applied to the front axle vs. the rear. The outcome is a bias split that is more in the order of 70 front/30 rear resulting in shorter and more controlled stops. 

  •  

  •  

  • BIGGER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER........

  • Putting bigger brakes on may not always be a good idea.

  • For chipped/re-mapped cars the obvious upgrade is 312mm fronts because it's so easy, and only requires carriers and discs for most models(not SDI, TDI 90, 100, 110, 115, 2.0 8v, 1.6 8v, 1.6 16v, 1.4 16v,).and because you have increased the power of the engine, the power to wheel will not be de-creased as it would if you just put bigger brakes on.

  • But, putting the 312mm conversion on a 1.4 for example, along with bigger wheels than standard and you will be adding alot of weight to your wheels, and the engine will be put under more strain, therefore reducing your accelleration. and Big brakes, contrary to popular beleif, don't actually do as much as people think in terms of stopping power increase, it's mainly that the disc heats up less, cools faster and therefore can stop the car more effectively, corner after corner without getting brake fade. IMO, the best brake mod for the smaller engined cars would be Performance pads and Performance Brake fluid, I wouldn't bother with drilled and grooved discs they just make your wallet lighter.

  •  

  • PICTURES

  • LCR Brembos

  • Posted Image

  • .:R32 Fronts

  • Posted Image

  • 312mm and 256mm Setup from an Octavia VRS

  • Posted Image

  • 288mm Fronts 

  • Posted Image 

  • 280mm FS-III Fronts

  • Posted Image

  • 256mm FS-III Fronts

  • Posted Image

  • 256mm vented rears

  • Posted Image

  • 232mm Rears

  • Posted Image 

  •  

  •  

  • PART NUMBERS

  •  

  • 256mm Rear splash Guards 1J0615609 & 1J0615610

  • 256mm Caliper Carrier right 1JO 615 425 E

  • 256mm Caliper Carrier left 1JO 615 426 E

  • 256mm Caliper right 8NO 615 424 C

  • 256mm Caliper left 8NO 615 423 C

  • 256mm Discs 8LO 615 601

  • 256mm OEM Pads 4BO 698 451 

  • Rear Wheel hub with bearing 1JO 501 477 A 


  • Front left 312mm Shield 1J0615312B
    Front right 312mm Shield N90305302


  •  

  • UPGRADES

  •  

  • Front

  •  

  • The easiest upgrade of all is the 288mm to 312mm front setup. All this requires is 312mm Carriers and Discs(splash guards if you want, but they are not essential)



  • owners of cars with the 288/312mm setup can also upgrade their calipers from 54mm to 57mm ones. not sure what model in the VAG range the calipers come from, but they are identical apart from the extra piston size

  • http://img824.imageshack.us/i/photo0224n.jpg/

  • it's also not proven if this is worth it, in theory it will work, but it's not been done much or well documented so do this mod at your own risk. possible drawback might be increased pedal travel

  •  

  • Upgrading 280mm FSIII's (AKA un-moddable without major work) take a bit more work as you have to change the hubs. these can be acquired from a breaker for relatively cheap, if the bearings have a little bit of play in, thats OK they will tighten up once the driveshaft is in place. if in doubt consult a garage. You can get new bearings fitted for relatively cheap so it might be worth it in the long run to get them changed whilst they are off the car. then once you have the hubs, you will need 312mm Calipers, Carriers, Pads and Discs, and splash guards.

  •  

  • Upgrading 256mm FS-III's to 280mm can be done by changing the hubs and discs alone, the calipers and pads are the same.

  •  

  • Rear

  •  

  • The standard 232mm Solids can be upgraded for the 256mm Vented setup, the bigger carriers & calipers just bolt straight on if they come from a 2WD car. If the calipers & carriers have come off a Quattro/4 Motion then you will need some 6mm spacers.

  • You will need to modify your standard splash guards as they curl in over the top of the std disc, and would catch on the new, larger disc. or alternatively you can fit 256mm splash guards, but the bearing has to come off, this can be tricky to do without spliting the bearings, a hydraulic puller and hammer chisel to free the race from the stub axle is what I used. EDIT, i would reccomend just replacing th wheel bearings if you are planning on fitting new splash guards


  • Posted Image

  • Upgrading the rear brakes does not do much in terms of braking power, reducing your stopping distance. The rear brakes only account for about 30%. Most people upgrade just for looks. 

  •  

  • PORSCHE CALIPERS

    porsce calipers are monoblock which means they are machined out of 1 solid peice of metal and are lighter and more rigid. LCR brembos are not monoblock, and heavier and not as rigid.

  • 996 rears:



  • 996 rears can be fitted on OEM 312mm discs with custom carriers which are available from DaveB1970. also available from him are some 325mm X 25mm discs which use the same carriers with another spacer to accomodate the larger disc. contact him for more info and prices.   these calipers are readily available, and go on ebay for about  £250 a pair which makes this a very reasonably priced upgrade. they have 28mm/30mm pistons thickest disc you can fit in them is 25mm. Are a waste of time, and are not an adviseable upgrade



  • the calipers you need are part numbers 996.352.421 and 996.352.422 but beware that this is the same part number as boxster rears and DO NOT FIT! luckily you can tell the difference by just looking at the calipers, see the pics below:



  • 996 REARS will be either red, silver or gloss black

  • http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb18/fenwick458/996rears2.jpg

  • BOXSTER REARS are a dull anodized black finish

  • http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb18/fenwick458/boxsterrears.jpg



  • there is an M6 hole drilled next to where the brake line connects on the 996 rears, shown in the photo below:

  • http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb18/fenwick458/holes.jpg



  • Boxster fronts



  • part numbers for these calipers are 986.352.421 and 986.352.422, they are very similar in appearence to the 996 rears above, but have some subtle differences. the geometry is the same though, so the same carriers are used as above with the 996 rears. they also have larger pistons which are 36mm and 40mm



  • 996 fronts / 996 turbo rears



  • the part numbers for these are 996.351.425 & 996.351.426 (996 fronts) or 996.352.425 & 996.352.426 (996 turbo rears)

  • piston sizes for the 996 turbo rears are 28mm and 30mm, and these use a slightly larger pad then the rest of the porsche rear calipers.

  • piston sizes for the 996 fronts are .................

  • these require a 28mm disc, there is a 330mm disc available from DaveB1970 which is much taller than the 312mm or 325mm disc and means theres less chance of needing a spacer to clear the caliperss



  • for the bigger calipers 429&430 and 431+432 then you need a 34mm discs.



  • WHEEL CLEARENCE

  •  

  • Before you get excited and rush out to buy a BBK, you gotta think about your wheel clearance.

  •  

  • ***NOTE*** rims are different sizes,different thickness walls, and therefore some may not fit.

  • these are the minimum wheel sizes, some may be very close, and may need the wheel re-balance with the weights put on the outside(not the rim face, but just not in the way of the caliper)

  • also some rim designs may require some spacer to fit around the caliper.

  •  

  • ***alot of BBS split rims or deep dish rims will struggle to clear brembos or other monoblock calipers, normally a 10mm spacer is all thats needed to clear them***

  •  

  • 334mm R32 brakes require 17"wheels

  • 312mm TT brakes require 16"wheels

  • 288mm Brakes require 15" wheels

  • 280mm Brakes require 15" wheels 

  •  

  • 256mm Rears need a 16"to clear the caliper(15"spare doesn't fit) 



  • most porsche brakes need a 10mm spacer on the front

  •  

  • PAINTING CALIPERS

  •  

  • most people paint there calipers to make them look better, the general consensus on the forum seems to be with big brakes go Anni Red or .:R32 Blue, but if you have standard calipers then a more subtle tone(black, silver, gunmetal grey) might be in order, because nothing looks more "max power" than small bright red/orange/yellow calipers.

  •  

  • before you paint them you will have to remove all the brake dust and the majority of the rust. then mask up the area you don't want paint on and paint. Hammerite smooth and B&Q Japlaq seem very popular. these are cheaper than a special caliper painting kit, which is just in a smaller pot and probably comes with a tin of brake cleaner worth a fiver, and costs more than twice the price.

  •  

  • give them a few coats and for best results don't drive in-between! 

  •  

  • BLEEDING BRAKES

  •  

  • http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb18/fenwick458/gunson.jpg 

  •  

  • It's important to do this properly, having even a little bit of air in there and its negating the big brakes you've just put on! I reccomend using the Gunson Eezi-Bleed system, it costs about 10-15 IIRC.

  • you just fill up the bottle, fit the correct resevoir cap from the box, then connect up the bottle to the spare tyre (20psi works best). the system is now pressurised and as soon as you crack a nipple fluid will come out, just wait untill the new stuff comes through then close it off. simple!

  •  

  • bleeding the brakes the old school way (as suggested by haynes manuals [8-)]) can damage the seal in the master cylinder and cause the brake pedal to feel soft all the time and travel quite far. this is because under normal circumstances the piston only moves 5-10mm at most, but when the piston goes the full length of the cylinder it goes over the rough and pitted surface, this can damage the seal and sometimes flip it rendering the MC useless.

  •  

     



    • Daveddcc, VTubby TDi, BigBang and 2 others like this


    #2 T10HJS

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    Posted 07 September 2007 - 05:22 PM

    very good post! loads of information in there, i will update you with some pics on Thursday 13th when my ECS Stage 5 big Brake kit is fitted, before you say i know 6 pots with 14" disks are over kill for 260Bhp but i do plan on going big turbo and hope to stick at 350Bhp even with that power 4 pots are ok its just for the few extra hundred pounds the WOW factor seems worth it. 

    #3 fenwick458

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 01:13 PM


    i will update you with some pics on Thursday 13th when my ECS Stage 5 big Brake kit is fitted

    look forward to seeing those on, they look massive!

    do you think it would be possible to beat the speedo needle to zero doing an e-stop! lol

    of course you would need some wide, sticky tyres to get that to happen, what size you got on there? 



    #4 deezer-d

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 02:02 PM

    Golf V5 170 has 256mm vented rear discs


    #5 fenwick458

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 02:16 PM

    Golf V5 170 has 256mm vented rear discs

    edited, cheers 



    #6 deezer-d

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 02:25 PM

    Great thread BTW [Y][Y]


    #7 tossy

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 02:37 PM

    great post and great idea - well done!


    Ive recently upgraded to the 312mm set up from a TT and im well chuffed.


    One thing i will add though is that when you pick your hubs up from a breakers a small amount of play in the bearings is nothing to worry about it will stiffen up when the drive shaft is inserted - Thats my two cents!



    #8 fenwick458

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 03:02 PM

    interesting, i bought my hubs from a scrapyard and they did have play, i did think that it would go away once the driveshaft and nut are on,  but i paid to get them re-newed at a garage anyway!

    it does give peace of mind though, and only cost 50quid.


    • jakeoconnell likes this

    #9 junglisteve

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 03:04 PM

    nice guide, im currently sortin out my 256mm rear upgrade, braided hoses and will use better fluid, cant wait.

    #10 Sean_Jaymo

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 03:25 PM

    One thing i will add though is that when you pick your hubs up from a breakers a small amount of play in the bearings is nothing to worry about it will stiffen up when the drive shaft is inserted - Thats my two cents!

    I used to have a missus like that [:P



    #11

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 04:45 PM

    ...so you can fit the R32 brakes under 17's then? Sweet!


    That would seem an amazing upgrade for a sleeper, as it would appear that most folks are turning away from 18's due to the ride quality. I guess that this would be the best upgrade for those with 312mm's when power starts getting up over 200bhp and wheel size allows!


    Also, doesn't the  Skoda green' caliper look subtle[:)], Perhaps people need to think wider for their caliper colours!


    Finally, I distantly recall seeing somewhere on the web (poss ebay) graphics to stick on calipers with the manufacturers name / logo on printed in a curve to go round the caliper radius. Anybody know what I mean?



    #12 fenwick458

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    Posted 12 September 2007 - 05:29 PM

    ...so you can fit the R32 brakes under 17's then? Sweet!

    yes 17"s should just fit over the calipers, buy may need to be re-balanced if theres balance weights stuck on the inside. 

    not sure about the stickers that curve? but i have seen some "heat proof decals" on ebay for relatively cheap 



    #13 hussar

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 03:11 AM

    312mm disks don't fit with 16" BBS RXII


    Found out the hard way........!



    #14 fenwick458

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 03:55 AM

    interesting. you got a pic of the rim?


    will have to edit the post now to read 'most' wheels will fit, some are very close!



    #15

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 04:34 AM

    Thanks - I was thinking about getting some RXII's to replace my MontrealI's just for something a little different!


    RXII is the RX as a 2-piece split rim.


    Here is a pic -although these have been well polished and had the backs painted black - sooooo cool[H]


     


    nb these are available as 6.5 and 7 inch widths, but I guess it is the extra material needed for the bolts that makes them not fit 312's - no wonder there is SO many of these for sale on ebay and.



    #16 zipper

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 04:53 AM

     What a post!! 10/10  [Y] [Y] [Y]


    Audi TT (180hp)


  • The Front brakes are 312mm x 25mm Vented Discs, 54mm ATE single piston calipers
  • The Rear brakes are 232mm x 9mm Solid Discs,

  • I went for this set up on my Golf with Tarox G88 312mm discs on the front and EBC pads (I really want Mintex though but can't seem to find them) also EBC pads on the rear



     



    #17

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 05:17 AM

    wheres the best place to obtain some 312mm grooved black diamond discs?

    #18 junglisteve

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 05:23 AM

    wheres the best place to obtain some 312mm grooved black diamond discs?

     

    try: http://www.potn.co.uk 



    #19 fenwick458

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 06:42 AM

    Black Diamond Drilled/Grooved discs  - 220 on the bay!

    seems a bit steep, are they really worth it??? 



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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 07:20 AM

    that price aint oo bad, but theres no point in going for drilled and grooved discs, just gonna wear pads more


    i'm gonna go with their grooved only format, much cheaper and wont wear pads as much!



    #21 Rhyso

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 08:30 AM

    Finally, I distantly recall seeing somewhere on the web (poss ebay) graphics to stick on calipers with the manufacturers name / logo on printed in a curve to go round the caliper radius. Anybody know what I mean?



     try Ebay; mate of mine got some; look pretty good if done corerctly



    #22 fenwick458

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 11:17 AM

    that price aint oo bad, but theres no point in going for drilled and grooved discs, just gonna wear pads more

    i'm gonna go with their grooved only format, much cheaper and wont wear pads as much!

     

    not really making sense there??? u seem to be saying theres no point using drilled/grooved discs cos they wear pads.......

    then you say you're gonna do it anyway!

    i would say that grooves wear pads more, because the drilled holes are normally chamfered so theres no sharp edge, and they just fill with dust, and there only small.

    grooves on the other hand go the full length of the disc and theres about 15-20 on each and they have a sharp edge.

    grooved discs will give a bit more bite initially, this bite you feel is the grooves eating the pad! 

     

    btw , none of the above help cooling, plain vented discs col very effectively as the surface area is more than doubled, and air is sucked in. only improvement on this cooling wise is 2-piece discs, fancy swirly vents,  or ceramic brakes and all 3 of those options cost more than 3 times the price of a std, plain vented disc.

    grooves - help shed dirt and water from the disc

    drilled - reduces weight

    drilled grooved discs are mostly applied for looks, their effect on performance is negligable.



     



    #23

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 11:29 AM

    sorry, i meant to say i'll be getting drilled only, since the grooved ones will wear pads and cause a bit of vibration :)

    #24 junglisteve

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 11:51 AM

    wish i never wasted money on my grooved and dimpled discs...[:^)]  oh well


    #25 fenwick458

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 11:56 AM

    wish i never wasted money on my grooved and dimpled discs...[:^)]  oh well

    not a complete waste, they do look good! 



    #26 tossy

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    Posted 13 September 2007 - 12:50 PM

    312mm brake upgrade from a TT with an audi heat proof decal as mentioned above:

    Posted Image



    #27 j8mbo

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    Posted 14 September 2007 - 02:07 PM

    hi guys just joined the forum.


    saw my ultimate plumbers 'van' today, the RS4 Avant. [:D] anyway it's got the smartest brakes i've ever seen. they must be 4 piston? with RS written on them.


    they will be mine, oh yes, they will be mine.....[6]


    anyone know the mods required to replace 280mm FSIII's? oh yeah sizes would be good too.


    jimbo



    #28 Dave J

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    Posted 14 September 2007 - 04:32 PM

    Nice thread chaps - good to have all this info in one place.


    I've had a few different combos on my 1.8t now. The factory 288mm set-up used to feel sharp until it was revo'd and then I realised it was overservo'd and the brakes weren't all that good. Then I fitted 312mm Zimmerman discs and greenstuff pads.


    I thought these worked well - although the greenstuff pads didn't seem to be any less dusty than the VW OEM pads (either that or I was working the brakes harder [:$]). It was this set-up that I used on the huge number of hairpins on the Stelvio pass in Italy, without any brake fade (whereas my mate in his Evo VIII FQ300 managed to set fire to his pads);


     Posted Image


    Mitsi vs golf - doesn't look too puny (both with 17's);


    Posted Image


    Admittedly, I didn't even try and drive at his speed. The TT discs, pads & calipers were a doddle to fit at home, and looked like...


    Posted Image


    ...however, you never have enough braking, so for a reasonable cost I upgraded to this 2-pot R32 setup;


    Posted Image


    They were a good price as they were from a 3.2 v6 TT, although the same as the R32. I bought EBC redstuff pads, new discs, braided hoses, all ancillaries, and also upgraded the rear to 256mm. As they were Audi front calipers, they were coated in the nasty factory grey powdercoat, and the rears were red anni's. Perhaps i should have painted them silver (as my previous set-up), but the R32 blue looks good, so I went with the foliatec kit, which is a very good match. 


    It's really progressive now. I thought the TT set-up was great when I first fitted it, but the R32 brakes are my first experience of really big discs and calipers with a large number of pistons. I can't imagine what some of the ECS brake sets must be like...



    #29

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    Posted 14 September 2007 - 05:03 PM

    what are the red stuff pads like?


    ie are they ok when cold and how well do they resist fade etc?



    #30 Dave J

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    Posted 14 September 2007 - 05:26 PM

    what are the red stuff pads like?


    ie are they ok when cold and how well do they resist fade etc?



    Personally, I can't really tell any difference between OEM and the Redstuff when cold ( I have slow town driving before I get to motorway off ramps on my daily commute). From the times I have given them anger on the country roads round here, I've been impressed. I would be interested to find out about the new Ferado pads that are supposed to be good. In general, they are a bit noisier than the OEM/Greenstuff pads I had as they are ceramic. So far, I've never had any fade on them on road use, but I really want to give them a go on a circuit, as I think the brakes will be great when really warmed up.


    I've heard of R32 owners complaining of brake fade on the 334mm discs and redstuff pads on the tyresmoke forum, but on my 1.8t (as it is a lighter car), I don't think I've found anywhere near the limit.  







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